Hi, was this every worked out? With my old house, I will need several hubs if I want to use buttons in different rooms. At this point I don't anticipate any "mobile" buttons, but one never knows what the future will bring. Additionally, I will want buttons in multiple locations to be able to control the same matter-enabled devices. Can i import a matter device into multiple FLIC hubs?

If this does work the way Emil describes above, it would be great to have a backup/restore/clone functions instead of having to add configurations to multiple hubs. Sorta weird that there is no backup function today...

@Emil said in Matter devices showing offline:

@buckyswider _matterc._udp is for commissioning, so that one is only present while the device is "pairable", typically 15 minutes after boot when the device is factory reset (i.e. no Matter pairings yet).

_matter._tcp shall be advertised after the device has been commissioned (paired), one service per "fabric" (i.e. per "hub" it has been commissioned to), as long as it is powered on and connected to the network. If it does not advertise this service, it will not be possible to reach it by Matter controllers. If you don't see this service when you expect to, it seems like a bug in that device.

Maybe you have devices from other Matter brands you can test with?

Hi again @Emil. The Tapo device seems to be advertising _matter.tcp most of the time now. Surfing the web leaves me confused about expected behaviour of Matter Wifi devices...so I did what any techie would do...I asked chatgpt! Now I know it's not perfect, but that answer seems to be a "No". Really curious is the statement about mDNS query. Again, I'm just spitballin' here, but is it possible that a hub is supposed to issue an mDNS query in normal operation to try to recover an offline device? I did email Leviton support as well to get their take on this. Here is the complete ChatGPT answer. Thanks!

No, a Matter-over-Wi-Fi device does not need to advertise the _matter._tcp service at all times, but it must do so when it is available for commissioning or reachable on the IP network for control or communication.

Here's how it works:

1. Commissioning Phase:

   • The device must advertise the _matter._tcp service via mDNS (Multicast DNS) during commissioning to allow controllers (e.g., smart home apps) to discover it.
   • This includes service subtypes that convey info like device type, vendor ID, etc.

2. Operational Phase:

   • Once the device is commissioned and in normal operation, it can limit or stop advertising _matter._tcp to reduce network chatter.
   • However, it must re-advertise it again if requested (e.g., via an mDNS query) or when the device is rebooted, comes back online, or changes its network configuration.

3. Dormant/Low Power Devices:

   • Battery-powered or low-power devices can defer or limit mDNS advertisement when in a sleep state, as long as they resume it appropriately when active or queried.

Summary:

A Matter-over-Wi-Fi device does not need to continuously advertise _matter._tcp, but must do so when it's discoverable (e.g., commissioning) or active on the network.

@Emil said in Matter devices showing offline:

@buckyswider _matterc._udp is for commissioning, so that one is only present while the device is "pairable", typically 15 minutes after boot when the device is factory reset (i.e. no Matter pairings yet).

_matter._tcp shall be advertised after the device has been commissioned (paired), one service per "fabric" (i.e. per "hub" it has been commissioned to), as long as it is powered on and connected to the network. If it does not advertise this service, it will not be possible to reach it by Matter controllers. If you don't see this service when you expect to, it seems like a bug in that device.

Maybe you have devices from other Matter brands you can test with?

Thanks @Emil ! I think we posted about the same time, but in case you haven't seen mine I rigged up a Tapo (TPLINK) switch to test. When it powered on, it advertised both TCP and UDP matter protocols. When I connected it to the FLIC hub, neither was showing anymore. I now saw this note, so I powered up the switch again, and it it showing both _tcp and _udp. Now an hour later...it is not showing either. I wonder if this is some anomaly of the scanner app? Oddly, I do now see another device showing _matter._tcp- but that appears to be an Amazon Echo. (IP matches that, but it looks like the scanner is showing a MAC, which doesn't match...aye karumba).

I will keep looking at the services scanner occasionally to see if anything else show up. Maybe I'll pick up a third manufacturer's matter wifi device to see how that behaves.

@Emil So I wired up a TAPO (TP Link) switch to see if it is advertising _matter. After connecting to WiFi (and before connecting to a Matter hub) I do see _matter._tcp and _matterc._udp. Now let me add it to Flic and see if keeps advertising...

So I added it to my Flic hub, and now it is NOT advertising either _matter protocol. Looks like the proper operation (based on devices from two different manufacturers) is to only advertise when you are not paired with a hub (or maybe in setup mode?). So my speculation here is that it is something with the matter hub- the hub thinks the device is still configured (but shows offline), and the device isn't advertising _matter because it is already owned by a hub...

Let me know if there's anything I can do to continue troubleshooting. I've kept the one device as showing "offline" for the time being...

@Emil said in Matter devices showing offline:

@buckyswider yes, assuming your phone/tablet you run the app on is connected to the same network as the flic hub and the Matter device, all Matter devices that are currently paired shall advertise that service, regardless of if it's connected or not.

Hmmm, that is weird then. I see many, many other services on my local network (who knew that TiVo had so many services!). But nothing that seems to be matter related, and DEFINITELY nothing with "Matter" in the name... I assume that since you need to know the service name to code your listener, it can't just be something that Leviton is doing differently...

@Emil said in Matter devices showing offline:

@buckyswider We have planned to add network packing logging to the hub in order to be able to debug situations like this, but have not yet had time to do that. The Flic Hub runs a DNS-SD listener in the background, waiting for its paired Matter devices to come available, and then connects to these. So the first step you can do is to use any DNS-SD app (like this https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.druk.servicebrowser) and verify that your device is there. Matter devices advertise themselves under the _matter._tcp service.

So to see if I could see anything advertising _matter._tcp, I put one of the "offline" devices into setup mode. When I opened the listener app, there still was no sign of anything matter. But when I went into the Flic app, VIOLA! The device was back online...

@Emil thanks. I don't see anything advertising that protocol at all- including my currently functioning devices. Once a device is connected to the hub, should it still be broadcasting that service?

@buckyswider said in Matter devices showing offline:

Hi @Emil, this has reared its ugly head again. This AM I have two matter devices that are showing "Offline" but can be controlled fine via other means. This time, it's two Leviton dimmable smart plugs. 5 other Matter devices (including another Leviton Smart Plug) are fine. I power cycled the hub with no difference. Is there anything I can do to troubleshoot this? Looking at this thread, the last time it happened it just self-cured. There has to be a reason this is happening...

Hi @Emil , can you advise any troubleshooting I can do? I don't want to have to occasionally just be forced to re-configure these devices.....both of these have been offline for a week now and aren't coming back themselves like the last time...

Hi @Emil, this has reared its ugly head again. This AM I have two matter devices that are showing "Offline" but can be controlled fine via other means. This time, it's two Leviton dimmable smart plugs. 5 other Matter devices (including another Leviton Smart Plug) are fine. I power cycled the hub with no difference. Is there anything I can do to troubleshoot this? Looking at this thread, the last time it happened it just self-cured. There has to be a reason this is happening...

@Emil said in FLIC Twist and Matter Plugs (WiFi):

I see that we are missing devices of type "Dimmable Plug-In Unit" in the filter for that list. We will add it to the next app update. In the meantime, you can use Advanced Dimming and set each trigger point to execute a Matter action which sets the specific brightness for that percentage.

this app update finally happened and it now works as expected. Thanks.

@Emil said in Matter devices showing offline:

@buckyswider The only thing I can think of is if any other app (Alexa or Leviton app) has thrown out the Flic Matter connection (Fabric) to the Flic Hub. In that case you would need to add it again to the Flic hub.

Figured I'd try to add it back to the Flic hub without deleting it. Put the device into setup mode and...it was no longer "offline" in the Flic app. Oh well.